Running an empty microwave oven

That would be a Magnetron tube, and yes, I thenk they all have a
thermostat on
the tube. This is also to prevent a fire if the cooling fan seizes up.
But, in the
case of no food to absorb the microwave energy, the reflected power can
build up
higher than normal voltages in the tube and cause permanent damage
before the
entire anode overheats.

Post by Peter Hucker
or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)

Parrots? What about kids? I suspect quite a few microwaves get "toasted"
by kids turning them on empty. I know they can survive a few seconds of
this abuse without noticeable damage. You could unplug it or leave the door
open (I'm pretty sure a parrot couldn't close the door.)

Jon

Peter Hucker

2007-01-20 17:02:15 UTC

Post by Jon Elson

So it'll just break? That's good to know. I don't want to lose a house or a parrot while out at work.

Post by Jon Elson

Parrots? What about kids? I suspect quite a few microwaves get "toasted"
by kids turning them on empty.

That's a point, it must happen a lot. If they caught fire or exploded, we'd see it on the news.

Post by Jon Elson
I know they can survive a few seconds of
this abuse without noticeable damage.

I once went for an interview at a company that makes magnetrons. As far as I know there is a thing that absorbs all returning microwaves. Wouldn't this just have a temperature sensor in it that would shut off the oven?

Post by Jon Elson
You could unplug it

The plug is behind the fridge. I used to plug it in above the worktop, but the parrots ate the plug!

Post by Jon Elson
or leave the door open (I'm pretty sure a parrot couldn't close the door.)

I bet it could, if it wanted to. But they are more interested in opening or breaking things. Parrots do not tidy or assemble things.

If I leave the door open, one will climb inside and chew up the cover that's over the magnetron output (it looks to be card).

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

"A computer lets you make more mistakes faster than any invention in human history--with the possible exceptions of handguns and tequila."

Jon Elson

2007-01-20 22:26:54 UTC

Post by Jon Elson

So it'll just break? That's good to know. I don't want to lose a house or a parrot while out at work.

Well, if it has the safety thermostat on the anode, then it will
just shut down, probably forever. I have no idea whether the
safety thermostat is mandated by law or required by testing
agencies like UL, and whether the really cheap ones from China
have them. Without the safety stat, I don't know what would happen.

Post by Peter Hucker
That's a point, it must happen a lot. If they caught fire or exploded, we'd see it on the news.

Well, I think there have been some fires from them, but probably
not a lot.

Post by Peter Hucker
I once went for an interview at a company that makes magnetrons. As far as I know there is a thing that absorbs all returning microwaves. Wouldn't this just have a temperature sensor in it that would shut off the oven?

Not in an oven. Maybe in a radar transmitter, they have an
expensive part called a circulator that splits waves going in
different directions, and shunts returning waves to a terminating
resistor. Nothing like that in a microwave oven, believe me.

Jon

Alison

2007-01-20 10:02:05 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)
Parrots. Cool :-)

Leave a cup of water in it. Or something like those heat up aromatherapy
bags, the ones that have lots of little cherry stones in it.

Peter Hucker

2007-01-20 16:56:34 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)
Parrots. Cool :-)

13 of them. Messy. Noisy. But fun.

Post by Peter Hucker
Leave a cup of water in it. Or something like those heat up aromatherapy
bags, the ones that have lots of little cherry stones in it.

That would only delay the problem. And I'd never remember to put a glass of water in after each time I use it.

I want to know what happens if it is switched on empty. The instructions just say it will damage it. That doesn't bother me too much, it was a very cheap one. As long as it doesn't explode or catch fire when I'm out of the house.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

What's the difference between spit and swallow?
Forty pounds of pressure on the back of her head.

PeterD

2007-01-20 21:03:42 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)
Parrots. Cool :-)

13 of them. Messy. Noisy. But fun.

Post by Peter Hucker
Leave a cup of water in it. Or something like those heat up aromatherapy
bags, the ones that have lots of little cherry stones in it.

That would only delay the problem. And I'd never remember to put a glass of water in after each time I use it.
I want to know what happens if it is switched on empty. The instructions just say it will damage it. That doesn't bother me too much, it was a very cheap one. As long as it doesn't explode or catch fire when I'm out of the house.

Look, the only safe thing is to unplug it. Even a glass of water won't
provide protection if they turn it on for 20 minutes! Use a short,
heavy duty (12 awg) extension cord, or some other similar device.

Either that, or make up a metal shield to cover the controls...

Peter Hucker

2007-01-22 19:05:21 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)
Parrots. Cool :-)

13 of them. Messy. Noisy. But fun.

Post by Peter Hucker
Leave a cup of water in it. Or something like those heat up aromatherapy
bags, the ones that have lots of little cherry stones in it.

That would only delay the problem. And I'd never remember to put a glass of water in after each time I use it.
I want to know what happens if it is switched on empty. The instructions just say it will damage it. That doesn't bother me too much, it was a very cheap one. As long as it doesn't explode or catch fire when I'm out of the house.

Nowhere is safe to plug it in without them chewing the plug. The plug has to be out of sight, which means I can't get to it to turn it off.

Post by PeterD
Either that, or make up a metal shield to cover the controls...

I bit of a hassle, and I'm useless at that kind of thing. And too lazy to do so unless I'm sure it would explode. Maybe I should buy another one and try it in the garden....

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Condoms aren't completely safe. A friend of mine was wearing one and got hit by a bus.

colin

2007-01-22 14:18:49 UTC

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

When I designed some of the early mcu controllers for them eons ago
we used to give them a heck of a lot of abuse such
as running them empty to try and get the mcu to crash,
(wich with a piggy back eprom mcu was all too easy)
ofc always a microwave leakage meter nearby,
the most spectacular thing was to melt the glass tray,
the turntable mechanism was the first thing to melt usually.

If theres food inside it will eventually catch fire and the flames will come
out of the back,
this was a serious liability worry at the time I assume theyve added some
safty things since I worked on them.

Some have water vapour detectors wich sense the peak and stop cooking, I
assume they will stop if nothing is detected.

Colin =^.^=

Peter Hucker

2007-01-22 19:01:58 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)
When I designed some of the early mcu controllers for them eons ago
we used to give them a heck of a lot of abuse such
as running them empty to try and get the mcu to crash,
(wich with a piggy back eprom mcu was all too easy)
ofc always a microwave leakage meter nearby,
the most spectacular thing was to melt the glass tray,
the turntable mechanism was the first thing to melt usually.
If theres food inside it will eventually catch fire and the flames will come
out of the back,
this was a serious liability worry at the time I assume theyve added some
safty things since I worked on them.
Some have water vapour detectors wich sense the peak and stop cooking, I
assume they will stop if nothing is detected.

This is a £27 Tesco Value microwave - probably only has legal safety requirements.

I've already turned it on momentarily with nothing in it, as I'm used to an electronic one. If my food has gone cold due to a phonecall etc, I tend to shove it in and just turn the timer round to get it to go, then open the door after 20 seconds. The electronic ones cancelled the timer when you opened the door, but this one turns back on when you shut the door.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

"Computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, 1949

colin

2007-01-23 00:53:27 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm

Post by Peter Hucker
concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)
When I designed some of the early mcu controllers for them eons ago
we used to give them a heck of a lot of abuse such
as running them empty to try and get the mcu to crash,
(wich with a piggy back eprom mcu was all too easy)
ofc always a microwave leakage meter nearby,
the most spectacular thing was to melt the glass tray,
the turntable mechanism was the first thing to melt usually.
If theres food inside it will eventually catch fire and the flames will come
out of the back,
this was a serious liability worry at the time I assume theyve added some
safty things since I worked on them.
Some have water vapour detectors wich sense the peak and stop cooking, I
assume they will stop if nothing is detected.

This is a £27 Tesco Value microwave - probably only has legal safety requirements.
I've already turned it on momentarily with nothing in it, as I'm used to

an electronic one. If my food has gone cold due to a phonecall etc, I tend
to shove it in and just turn the timer round to get it to go, then open the
door after 20 seconds. The electronic ones cancelled the timer when you
opened the door, but this one turns back on when you shut the door.

Well, we used to leave them on for 24 hours soak test, if you put anything
in them it would be long incinerated by then,
so they were run empty,
they used to end up real hot but theres probably only about 600W of
microwave heating power plus losses ofc and theres a fan wich gets rid of
most of the heat so total temp rise is limited, the only real danger that I
can see is that it gets so hot the plastic/ferrite door seal melts,
this is serious becuase it is essential to form a safe seal from microwave
energy leaking past the door,
if the electronics gets too hot and melts it should safely blow the fuse and
so will no work again so should be safe.
if the magnetron blows up ofc this will probably also blow the fuse and end
up safe.
If the fan vent gets blocked this would probably make a meltdown more
certain.
ofc we did this in a building with little risk of any fire spreading.

but I assume theres a maximum limit on the timer ? polly would have to keep
setting it to max to cuase a problem I would think.
However this is by no means saying that it is safe, just that it is not
definatly going to be dangerous.
I wouldnt dare do that sort of thing these days lol.
I just hope your parrot doesnt learn how to open the door !

Colin =^.^=

Peter Hucker

2007-01-23 20:01:48 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron

overheating,

Post by Peter Hucker
or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm

come

Post by Peter Hucker
out of the back,
this was a serious liability worry at the time I assume theyve added

some

Post by Peter Hucker
safty things since I worked on them.
Some have water vapour detectors wich sense the peak and stop cooking, I
assume they will stop if nothing is detected.

This is a £27 Tesco Value microwave - probably only has legal safety

requirements.

Post by Peter Hucker
I've already turned it on momentarily with nothing in it, as I'm used to

an electronic one. If my food has gone cold due to a phonecall etc, I tend
to shove it in and just turn the timer round to get it to go, then open the
door after 20 seconds. The electronic ones cancelled the timer when you
opened the door, but this one turns back on when you shut the door.
Well, we used to leave them on for 24 hours soak test, if you put anything
in them it would be long incinerated by then,
so they were run empty,
they used to end up real hot but theres probably only about 600W of
microwave heating power plus losses ofc and theres a fan wich gets rid of
most of the heat so total temp rise is limited, the only real danger that I
can see is that it gets so hot the plastic/ferrite door seal melts,
this is serious becuase it is essential to form a safe seal from microwave
energy leaking past the door,
if the electronics gets too hot and melts it should safely blow the fuse and
so will no work again so should be safe.
if the magnetron blows up ofc this will probably also blow the fuse and end
up safe.
If the fan vent gets blocked this would probably make a meltdown more
certain.
ofc we did this in a building with little risk of any fire spreading.

Sounds reassuring. But does this also apply to cheap ones?

Post by Peter Hucker
but I assume theres a maximum limit on the timer ? polly would have to keep
setting it to max to cuase a problem I would think.

Most likely they'd turn it slightly, about 5 minutes. When the thing turned on they'd probably get a fright and fly off anyway.

Post by Peter Hucker
However this is by no means saying that it is safe, just that it is not
definatly going to be dangerous.
I wouldnt dare do that sort of thing these days lol.
I just hope your parrot doesnt learn how to open the door !

I can't see them opening the door. The like to twist and chew stuff. The door requires a hard pull (no button to push).

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A father is someone who carries pictures where his money used to be.

colin

2007-01-27 01:34:15 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron

overheating,

Post by Peter Hucker
or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm

come

Post by Peter Hucker
out of the back,
this was a serious liability worry at the time I assume theyve added

some

Post by Peter Hucker
safty things since I worked on them.
Some have water vapour detectors wich sense the peak and stop cooking, I
assume they will stop if nothing is detected.

This is a £27 Tesco Value microwave - probably only has legal safety

requirements.

Post by Peter Hucker
I've already turned it on momentarily with nothing in it, as I'm used to

an electronic one. If my food has gone cold due to a phonecall etc, I tend
to shove it in and just turn the timer round to get it to go, then open the
door after 20 seconds. The electronic ones cancelled the timer when you
opened the door, but this one turns back on when you shut the door.
Well, we used to leave them on for 24 hours soak test, if you put anything
in them it would be long incinerated by then,
so they were run empty,
they used to end up real hot but theres probably only about 600W of
microwave heating power plus losses ofc and theres a fan wich gets rid of
most of the heat so total temp rise is limited, the only real danger that I
can see is that it gets so hot the plastic/ferrite door seal melts,
this is serious becuase it is essential to form a safe seal from microwave
energy leaking past the door,
if the electronics gets too hot and melts it should safely blow the fuse and
so will no work again so should be safe.
if the magnetron blows up ofc this will probably also blow the fuse and end
up safe.
If the fan vent gets blocked this would probably make a meltdown more
certain.
ofc we did this in a building with little risk of any fire spreading.

Sounds reassuring. But does this also apply to cheap ones?

Some of the ones we had were quite cheap, actually some were pretty awfull,
and some of the controllers we had to make had to be so cheap it was a
shame.
the basic magnetron/oven arangement was hardly any different from the cheap
to expensive ones.

Post by Peter Hucker
but I assume theres a maximum limit on the timer ? polly would have to keep
setting it to max to cuase a problem I would think.

Most likely they'd turn it slightly, about 5 minutes. When the thing

turned on they'd probably get a fright and fly off anyway.

I doubt it would go pop after 5 minutes just becuase it was empty, I would
be even more surprised if it became dengerous after 5 minutes on empty too,
either way the manafacturer would probably have a liability waiting to
happen.

If you do decide to try it empty despite what the manafacturer tells you its
on your own risk ofc, make sure the glass tray is still in as that does
absorb some microwave energy.

a CD makes an interesting display when you put it in the microwave.

Post by Peter Hucker
I can't see them opening the door. The like to twist and chew stuff. The

door requires a hard pull (no button to push).

One of my cats managed to repeatedly get out of a locked cat flap. I couldnt
figure out how untill I watched once.
animals can surprise you sometimes.

Colin =^.^=

Geoff

2007-01-23 01:58:12 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron
overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.
I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously,
they do stuff like that)

They will never reach the button, from inside.

CDs go really well in microwaves !

geoff

Warren Weber

2007-01-23 02:37:50 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,
or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm
concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com

Parrots are smart. One will go inside, next one could shut the door and turn
it on. Baked parrot for supper?

Peter Hucker

2007-01-23 20:02:22 UTC

Post by Warren Weber

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,
or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm
concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com

Parrots are smart. One will go inside, next one could shut the door and turn
it on. Baked parrot for supper?

As far as I know they're vegetarian.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

NEWSFLASH!!! Bouncing elephantiasis woman destroys central Portsmouth

Snap Whipcrack..............

2007-01-23 16:49:43 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)

Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

2007-01-23 18:58:02 UTC

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

This isn't completely correct. A magnetron running into a perfectly
matched (lossy) load will see no reflected power. One operating into a
perfectly reactive load, an open or short for example, will see a large
reflected signal which will add to the forward wave. The result will be
higher voltage/current at the tube and a different operating point.

This is in fact a sort of feedback. It might be possible for the
tube or PS to fail due to excessive peak voltage or peak current. The
changed operating point might also cause more heat dissipation in the
tube or PS.

g

Jon Elson

2007-01-23 19:46:37 UTC

Post by g

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

This isn't completely correct. A magnetron running into a perfectly
matched (lossy) load will see no reflected power. One operating into a
perfectly reactive load, an open or short for example, will see a
large reflected signal which will add to the forward wave. The result
will be higher voltage/current at the tube and a different operating
point.
This is in fact a sort of feedback. It might be possible for the
tube or PS to fail due to excessive peak voltage or peak current. The
changed operating point might also cause more heat dissipation in the
tube or PS.

Assuming a true, perfect short at the end of the waveguide, then the
only dissipating
element left is the filament/cathode of the magnetron. Since there is
no real waveguide,
and the oven compartment is far from a perfect short, energy will be
dissipated in everything,
metal, plastic, glass, RF seals, etc.

Jon

Peter Hucker

2007-01-23 20:02:46 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)

Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Q. What's hairy on the outside, wet on the inside, begins with a "C" and ends with a "T"?
A. A coconut.

Snap Whipcrack..............

2007-01-24 14:53:25 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)

Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

It dissipates. Where do you think the microwave transmitters on mountain
tops power ends up? It doesn't go round and round the earth forever.

Peter Hucker

2007-01-26 19:14:47 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)

Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

It dissipates. Where do you think the microwave transmitters on mountain
tops power ends up? It doesn't go round and round the earth forever.

It's absorbed into water, in lakes for example.

A closed microwave has nothing that can absorb it.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Advice for office managers:
If you keep the sexual harassment complaint forms in the bottom drawer, then when a woman gets one out you'll get a great view of her arse.

colin

2007-01-27 01:38:36 UTC

overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

It dissipates. Where do you think the microwave transmitters on mountain
tops power ends up? It doesn't go round and round the earth forever.

It's absorbed into water, in lakes for example.
A closed microwave has nothing that can absorb it.

The glass tray will usually absorb some of the microwave, basically when its
empty the electric field builds up to such a high value that it eventually
gets absorbed by something somewhere, or it ends up disipating in sparking
wich can be quite spectacular if have two bits of unconnected metal close to
eachother.

Colin =^.^=

Peter Hucker

2007-01-28 18:19:20 UTC

On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:53:25 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 16:49:43 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron

overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

It dissipates. Where do you think the microwave transmitters on mountain
tops power ends up? It doesn't go round and round the earth forever.

It's absorbed into water, in lakes for example.
A closed microwave has nothing that can absorb it.

Brainiac Science Abuse (TV program) put a set of five swinging balls (one of them office toys) in a microwave on its own. The microwave exploded spectacularly after less than a minute. Can you explain that?

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

If there's a fire why not just open the fire exit to let it out?

colin

2007-01-28 23:03:36 UTC

On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:53:25 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 16:49:43 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron

overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

It dissipates. Where do you think the microwave transmitters on mountain
tops power ends up? It doesn't go round and round the earth forever.

It's absorbed into water, in lakes for example.
A closed microwave has nothing that can absorb it.

Brainiac Science Abuse (TV program) put a set of five swinging balls (one

of them office toys) in a microwave on its own. The microwave exploded
spectacularly after less than a minute. Can you explain that?

From what ive seen of braniac they probably filled it with something that
would explode spectacularly.
I wonder what the balls were made of, something explosive perhaps ?
ordinary flour or paper dust can make a very good explosive if mixed with
air.

Colin =^.^=

Peter Hucker

2007-01-30 19:22:10 UTC

On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:53:25 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
It dissipates. Where do you think the microwave transmitters on

mountain

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
tops power ends up? It doesn't go round and round the earth forever.

It's absorbed into water, in lakes for example.
A closed microwave has nothing that can absorb it.

The glass tray will usually absorb some of the microwave, basically when

its

Post by colin
empty the electric field builds up to such a high value that it

eventually

Post by colin
gets absorbed by something somewhere, or it ends up disipating in

sparking

Post by colin
wich can be quite spectacular if have two bits of unconnected metal

close to

Post by colin
eachother.

Brainiac Science Abuse (TV program) put a set of five swinging balls (one

of them office toys) in a microwave on its own. The microwave exploded
spectacularly after less than a minute. Can you explain that?
From what ive seen of braniac they probably filled it with something that
would explode spectacularly.
I wonder what the balls were made of, something explosive perhaps ?
ordinary flour or paper dust can make a very good explosive if mixed with
air.

You mean they were lying?!?

A colleague suggested that large metal objects might "short circuit" the magnetron and draw more power from it than it expects. I didn't agree or disagree, I know nothing about that sort of thing.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Caller: "Can you give me the telephone number for Jack?"
Operator: "I'm sorry, sir, I don't understand who you are talking about".
Caller: "On page 1, section 5, of the user guide it clearly states that I need to unplug the fax machine from the AC wall socket and telephone Jack before cleaning. Now, can you give me the number for Jack?"

colin

2007-02-01 12:58:14 UTC

On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:53:25 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
It dissipates. Where do you think the microwave transmitters on

mountain

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
tops power ends up? It doesn't go round and round the earth forever.

It's absorbed into water, in lakes for example.
A closed microwave has nothing that can absorb it.

The glass tray will usually absorb some of the microwave, basically when

its

Post by colin
empty the electric field builds up to such a high value that it

eventually

Post by colin
gets absorbed by something somewhere, or it ends up disipating in

sparking

Post by colin
wich can be quite spectacular if have two bits of unconnected metal

close to

Post by colin
eachother.

Brainiac Science Abuse (TV program) put a set of five swinging balls (one

of them office toys) in a microwave on its own. The microwave exploded
spectacularly after less than a minute. Can you explain that?
From what ive seen of braniac they probably filled it with something that
would explode spectacularly.
I wonder what the balls were made of, something explosive perhaps ?
ordinary flour or paper dust can make a very good explosive if mixed with
air.

You mean they were lying?!?

well normally in order to cuase an explosion you have to have a combustable
material that burns very quickly,
the force comes from the fact that the burnt material wich is oxidesed takes
up a great deal more volume
and until it expands is under great pressure. in an empty oven there is no
combustables.

they always seem to try something to see if it blows up and if it doesnt
then they make sure it does, its often a caravan or microwave oven that gets
blown up.

Post by Peter Hucker
A colleague suggested that large metal objects might "short circuit" the

magnetron and draw more power from it than it expects. I didn't agree or
disagree, I know nothing about that sort of thing.

It cant 'draw' more power from it unless that power actualy goes somewhere,
however it can put the magnetron under more stress, the voltages and current
may be higher even though the power is actually less, ie they are out of
phase and hence arnt both high at the same time.

but theres actually not that much to a magnetron, theres a central cathode
wich is like a rod with a heater inside, and a circular anode around this
with slots in, all in a vacuum and also not surprisngly a strong magnet.
The power is picked up via a piece of wire inbetween one of the slots.
The anode is what gets hot due to current flowing and is attatched to a
quite large heatsink with great number of fins wich has a fan blowing on it.

theres not a great deal to go wrong, its simplicity is its strength, the
same basic design was used 60 years ago, it could lose the vacuum of course,
or the insulation could fail, or the heater could break, or the magnet could
lose its strength but most of the parts are designed to work at a high
temperature, its just metal and glass, its not like silicon wich self
destructs at 200'c.

The transformer does actually limit the current anyway.

Colin =^.^=

PeterD

2007-02-01 14:00:58 UTC

On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 12:58:14 GMT, "colin"

Post by colin
well normally in order to cuase an explosion you have to have a combustable
material that burns very quickly,
the force comes from the fact that the burnt material wich is oxidesed takes
up a great deal more volume
and until it expands is under great pressure. in an empty oven there is no
combustables.

WEll, almost right... (and your 'normally' does apply, so what you say
is true, but there's more! <bg>)

All you need is pressure, not a combustable substance.

In the case of the balls that 'exploded' were they to have a 'strong'
outter shell, and a high moisture content inside, the moisture could
easily convert to steam and build up pressure until the outer shell
failed--an explosion... It would not be difficult to build up a
hundred PSI of steam pressure, and that would result in a rather large
'bang'!

colin

2007-02-02 00:58:17 UTC

Post by PeterD
On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 12:58:14 GMT, "colin"

WEll, almost right... (and your 'normally' does apply, so what you say
is true, but there's more! <bg>)
All you need is pressure, not a combustable substance.
In the case of the balls that 'exploded' were they to have a 'strong'
outter shell, and a high moisture content inside, the moisture could
easily convert to steam and build up pressure until the outer shell
failed--an explosion... It would not be difficult to build up a
hundred PSI of steam pressure, and that would result in a rather large
'bang'!

aha yes the Boiling liquid expanding vapour explosions didnt think of that
at the time,
but I did think enough to say normally lol,
bit like eggs that explode when you put them in a microwave without first
making a hole in them,
although its not all that exciting.

Colin =^.^=

species5618

2007-02-02 02:25:48 UTC

Post by PeterD
On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 12:58:14 GMT, "colin"

Post by colin
well normally in order to cuase an explosion you have to have a

combustable

Post by colin
material that burns very quickly,
the force comes from the fact that the burnt material wich is oxidesed

takes

Post by colin
up a great deal more volume
and until it expands is under great pressure. in an empty oven there is

Post by colin
combustables.

WEll, almost right... (and your 'normally' does apply, so what you say
is true, but there's more! <bg>)
All you need is pressure, not a combustable substance.
In the case of the balls that 'exploded' were they to have a 'strong'
outter shell, and a high moisture content inside, the moisture could
easily convert to steam and build up pressure until the outer shell
failed--an explosion... It would not be difficult to build up a
hundred PSI of steam pressure, and that would result in a rather large
'bang'!

Once upon a time whilst visiting the in-laws in Germany, my wife
reheated some hard boiled eggs in their shells in the microwave by
placing an egg in a glass tumbler and then a slightly larger one over
the first 'in case they pop'. They were then placed on the table for
'früstück'. A full two minutes later an egg exploded covering not only
us, but the ceiling, drapes and nick nak display shelves with egg. A
frantic clean up campaign started as was had a little over a hour to
restore the dining room to its pristine condition before the
mother-in-law returned. We can laugh about it now, but we never have
told the in-laws about it. One day when my father-in-law has to change a
light bulb (long-life of course) he might find a bit of dried egg and
wonder....

Fred McKenzie

2007-01-25 19:22:41 UTC

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

Peter-

If there is nothing in the microwave, there is no load, or at least very
little. If there is no load, there is no power dissipated. It is
somewhat like having 120 VAC at the wall socket with nothing plugged-in.

The problem isn't heat as much as voltage. With no load, the magnetron
voltage will be higher than normal. The question is really whether or
not damage will occur from over-voltage.

Someone in another thread a few weeks ago, said that only very early
microwave ovens would be damaged by running them empty. I know that one
I bought in 1976 came with a warning about running it empty, as well as
not putting anything metallic in it. However, two that were bought
about ten years ago did NOT come with such warnings, and even came with
metal racks!

Fred

2007-01-26 05:19:47 UTC

Post by Fred McKenzie
If there is nothing in the microwave, there is no load, or at least very
little. If there is no load, there is no power dissipated. It is
somewhat like having 120 VAC at the wall socket with nothing plugged-in.

While this is true, relative to the normal operation of the oven, I
don't think it is quite correct to characterize the unloaded oven this
way.

Here's why I say this:

If there is no additional load (an empty oven) there is still a load,
but it's mainly reactive. This means that the energy the tube generates
reflects, rather than being absorbed. There is a high SWR (Standing Wave
Ratio). When the returning comes back to the tube, it sums vectorially
with the outgoing wave. This may result in anything from zero to twice
the magnitude RF voltage. Put another way, the phase of the reflection
may be anything from an open to a short, including everything
in-between. As a result, the tube may see *either* excess voltage or
excess current.

But, there is in fact always *some* load in the system. This is what
causes real energy (heat) to be dissipated within (mainly) the tube. For
the unloaded (no user supplied loss) case, these intrinsic losses, R's,
whether from dielectric or conductive elements, will tend to see higher
voltage or current than they normally would. The power lost in these
R's, is generally related to either I^2R or E^2/R. But for the case of
doubling(say) voltage or current these loses quadruple.

As a consequence *more* power may be dissipated *within the tube* when
there is no user-supplied load than was the case with straight-and-level
operation with a normal cooking chamber load.

This increased dissipation along with the potential for increased
current and increased voltage within the tube may cause things to be
tougher on the tube. Often power devices are specified to operate into
some maximum SWR and it may be that modern magnetrons can no take
whatever is likely to be thrown their way.

Exactly what happens is probably a pretty complicated function of the
whole assembly, dimensions and such. But it isn't unreasonable to think
that the tube might get hotter, in addition to being stressed in terms
of it's voltage and current limits.

g

Peter Hucker

2007-01-26 19:13:18 UTC

Post by Fred McKenzie

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

I don't think you're right. The magnetron is converting electricity to microwaves and transmitting them, at a rate of several hundred watts. They come out of the magnetron and bounce around the oven until they are absorbed by water. If they are not absorbed, they will eventually bounce back into the magetron and cause damage.

Post by Fred McKenzie
The problem isn't heat as much as voltage. With no load, the magnetron
voltage will be higher than normal. The question is really whether or
not damage will occur from over-voltage.
Someone in another thread a few weeks ago, said that only very early
microwave ovens would be damaged by running them empty. I know that one
I bought in 1976 came with a warning about running it empty, as well as
not putting anything metallic in it. However, two that were bought
about ten years ago did NOT come with such warnings,

I just bought a very cheap one (£27) which DID come with a warning. It says "damage to the oven may occur".

Post by Fred McKenzie
and even came with metal racks!

The metal is only a problem in certain shapes I believe. All it does is provide a short circuit from point A to point B for the microwaves. If the metal is thin (eg. gold plating) it will be damaged by heat, just as a thin wire would be conducting electricity.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

These questions about South Africa were posted on a South African Tourism
Website and were answered by the website owner.

Q: Does it ever get windy in South Africa? I have never seen it rain on TV, so how do the plants grow? (UK)
A: We import all plants fully grown and then just sit around watching them die.

Q: Will I be able to see elephants in the street? (USA)
A: Depends how much you've been drinking.

Q: I want to walk from Durban to Cape Town - can I follow the railroad tracks? (Sweden)
A: Sure, it's only two thousand kilometres, take lots of water...

Q: Can you give me some information about Koala Bear racing in South Africa? (USA)
A: Aus-tra-lia is that big island in the middle of the pacific. A-fri-ca is the big triangle shaped continent south of Europe which does not... oh forget it. Sure, the Koala Bear racing is every Tuesday night in Hillbrow. Come naked.

Q: Can you send me the Vienna Boys' Choir schedule? (USA)
A: Aus-tri-a is that quaint little country bordering Ger-man-y, which is...oh forget it. Sure, the Vienna Boys Choir plays every Tuesday night in Hillbrow, straight after the Koala Bear races. Come naked.

Q: Do you have perfume in South Africa? (France)
A: No, WE don't stink.

Q: I have developed a new product that is the fountain of youth. Can you tell me where I can sell it in South Africa? (USA)
A: Anywhere significant numbers of Americans gather.

Q: Are there killer bees in South Africa? (Germany)
A: Not yet, but for you, we'll import them.

Q: Are there supermarkets in Cape Town and is milk available all year round? (Germany)
A: No, we are a peaceful civilization of vegan hunter-gatherers. Milk is illegal.

Q: Will I be able to speek English most places I go? (USA)
A: Yes, but you'll have to learn it first.

Snap Whipcrack..............

2007-01-28 15:35:16 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)

Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

Same question, where do the light waves go from the light inside the
microwave? Same energy, just higher frequency and lower power. Same
place as the microwaves.

Peter Hucker

2007-01-28 18:21:54 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do stuff like that)

Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

Same question, where do the light waves go from the light inside the
microwave? Same energy, just higher frequency and lower power. Same
place as the microwaves.

Light is absorbed into all sorts of things. Microwaves are NOT absorbed into anything inside the oven. They are reflected completely by the metal sides.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Two cowboys are riding along a trail in the mountains when they suddenly hear tom toms beating very close to them.
"Oh! That doesn't sound good," one says to the other.
As soon as the words were spoken, an Indian jumps out from behind a tree and said, "Yeah, our regular drummer is out sick."

colin

2007-01-28 23:07:49 UTC

overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

Same question, where do the light waves go from the light inside the
microwave? Same energy, just higher frequency and lower power. Same
place as the microwaves.

Light is absorbed into all sorts of things. Microwaves are NOT absorbed

into anything inside the oven. They are reflected completely by the metal
sides.

not completly, even if they were silver coated it would still not be quite
100%,
it bounces back and forth so quickly eventually even the smallest loss gets
multiplied suficiently to absorb considerable energy.

Colin =^.^=

Bill Janssen

2007-01-29 00:40:56 UTC

On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:35:16 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 16:49:43 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron

overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Snap Whipcrack..............
Microwave ovens don't care what you put inside. They do not have
feedback loops. You can cook a raisin or a melon or nothing at all.

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

Same question, where do the light waves go from the light inside the
microwave? Same energy, just higher frequency and lower power. Same
place as the microwaves.

Light is absorbed into all sorts of things. Microwaves are NOT absorbed

into anything inside the oven. They are reflected completely by the metal
sides.
not completly, even if they were silver coated it would still not be quite
100%,
it bounces back and forth so quickly eventually even the smallest loss gets
multiplied suficiently to absorb considerable energy.
Colin =^.^=

While the microwave is bouncing around in the oven there will be
locations where the signal combines to generate
high voltages and other places where high currents are generated. These
locations can be in side of the Magnetron.

Bill K7NOM

Peter Hucker

2007-01-30 19:23:10 UTC

On Sun, 28 Jan 2007 15:35:16 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 16:49:43 -0000, Snap Whipcrack..............

break it?
overheating, or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?
I'm concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, t=

hey do

Post by Peter Hucker
stuff like that)

But where do you think the power ends up if it is not absorbed?

Same question, where do the light waves go from the light inside th=

microwave? Same energy, just higher frequency and lower power. Same=
place as the microwaves.

Light is absorbed into all sorts of things. Microwaves are NOT abso=

rbed

Post by Peter Hucker
into anything inside the oven. They are reflected completely by the =

metal

Post by Peter Hucker
sides.
not completly, even if they were silver coated it would still not be =

quite

Post by Peter Hucker
100%,
it bounces back and forth so quickly eventually even the smallest los=

s gets

Post by Peter Hucker
multiplied suficiently to absorb considerable energy.
Colin =3D^.^=3D

While the microwave is bouncing around in the oven there will be
locations where the signal combines to generate
high voltages and other places where high currents are generated. Thes=

Post by Bill Janssen
locations can be in side of the Magnetron.

As long as it doesn't explode. I have a good mind to try it with my old=
one. Outside.

-- =

http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http:=
//www.petersphotos.com

This exchange was overheard between the separated sections of the jail.
A male voice yells over to the female side: "I got 12 inches over here y=
ou would love to have."
The female response was: "Well, spit it out it isn't yours."

jasen

2007-01-29 10:06:51 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Light is absorbed into all sorts of things. Microwaves are NOT absorbed
into anything inside the oven. They are reflected completely by the metal
sides.

that's not happening not unless those sides are superconductive

--
Bye.
Jasen

2007-01-29 15:38:29 UTC

Post by jasen

Post by Peter Hucker
Light is absorbed into all sorts of things. Microwaves are NOT absorbed
into anything inside the oven. They are reflected completely by the metal
sides.

that's not happening not unless those sides are superconductive

There's also the matter of the efficiency of the magnetron changing when
presented with a very reactive (reflective) load. In addition to the
tube getting hotter from the larger voltage and current peaks which
cause increased microwave losses inside, the tube no longer is as
effective at producing microwave energy and a higher percentage of the
input energy gets converted directly to heat.

g

Daniel Mandic

2007-01-23 20:59:45 UTC

Peter Hucker wrote:

(Seriously,

Post by Peter Hucker
they do stuff like that)

Aha. My Cats like to turn on my Vaccuum cleaner and I get shocked, in
the first moments. :)

(Seriously, I have left the Vacuum cleaner connected to the wall-socket
many times, indeed. But it was never on, when I came back home)

Peter Hucker

2007-01-26 19:15:50 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
(Seriously,

Post by Peter Hucker
they do stuff like that)

Aha. My Cats like to turn on my Vaccuum cleaner and I get shocked, in
the first moments. :)
(Seriously, I have left the Vacuum cleaner connected to the wall-socket
many times, indeed. But it was never on, when I came back home)

I have had them chew through the flex.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

When eating a tongue sandwich, how do you know when you've finished?

Geoff

2007-01-29 00:24:34 UTC

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:59:45 -0000, Daniel Mandic

Post by Peter Hucker
(Seriously,

Post by Peter Hucker
they do stuff like that)

Aha. My Cats like to turn on my Vaccuum cleaner and I get shocked, in
the first moments. :)
(Seriously, I have left the Vacuum cleaner connected to the
wall-socket many times, indeed. But it was never on, when I came
back home)

I have had them chew through the flex.

I suggest that the main problem is your desire to have 14 parrots in your
house.

geoff

Peter Hucker

2007-01-30 19:50:07 UTC

Post by Geoff

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:59:45 -0000, Daniel Mandic

Post by Peter Hucker
(Seriously,

Post by Peter Hucker
they do stuff like that)

Aha. My Cats like to turn on my Vaccuum cleaner and I get shocked, in
the first moments. :)
(Seriously, I have left the Vacuum cleaner connected to the
wall-socket many times, indeed. But it was never on, when I came
back home)

I have had them chew through the flex.

I suggest that the main problem is your desire to have 14 parrots in your
house.

13.

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A thousand monkeys pounding on a thousand typewriters will eventually produce either the bible, or a system error.

Geoff

2007-01-30 20:56:02 UTC

Post by Geoff
I suggest that the main problem is your desire to have 14 parrots in
your house.

13.

That's just unlucky !

geoff

h***@sbcglobal.net

2007-02-01 00:19:42 UTC

most with glass rotating trays will run, the glass absorbs enough rays to
heat up slightly but wont smoke anything.

might ruin your electric bill budget though. ;-))

shakle the damm bird to the cage/perch

or teach the bird to climb inside to warm itself up. ;-P

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Peter Hucker
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com

http://www.petersphotos.com

Post by Peter Hucker
A Pakistani arrives in London City all excited. He stops the first person

he meets. "Good day, Mr. British, thank you to accept me in Your nice
country", but the person interrupts and says: "I am not British, I'm
Chinese."

Post by Peter Hucker
The Pakistani continues on his way and meets another passer-by. "Thank you

Mr. British for to let my family and me stay here... " Again, he's
interrupted before finishing his sentence. "I no be British, I be Turk!"

Post by Peter Hucker
He goes a little farther and meets another person and greets him "thank

you for letting me come to your beautiful country." ... "I'm not British,
I'm Kosavon."

Post by Peter Hucker
"But," answers the Pakistani distressed, "where are the British??"
The Kosavon looks at his watch and says ..... "Probably at work."

Peter Hucker

2007-02-02 19:40:36 UTC

They're cleverer than you think. One escaped, and flew from tree to tree waiting for me to chase after him. Came back the following day by himself, after flying for miles all over the place.

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
most with glass rotating trays will run, the glass absorbs enough rays to
heat up slightly but wont smoke anything.
might ruin your electric bill budget though. ;-))
shakle the damm bird to the cage/perch
or teach the bird to climb inside to warm itself up. ;-P

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control. I'm

concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Peter Hucker
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com

http://www.petersphotos.com

Post by Peter Hucker
A Pakistani arrives in London City all excited. He stops the first person

he meets. "Good day, Mr. British, thank you to accept me in Your nice
country", but the person interrupts and says: "I am not British, I'm
Chinese."

Post by Peter Hucker
The Pakistani continues on his way and meets another passer-by. "Thank you

Mr. British for to let my family and me stay here... " Again, he's
interrupted before finishing his sentence. "I no be British, I be Turk!"

Post by Peter Hucker
He goes a little farther and meets another person and greets him "thank

you for letting me come to your beautiful country." ... "I'm not British,
I'm Kosavon."

Post by Peter Hucker
"But," answers the Pakistani distressed, "where are the British??"
The Kosavon looks at his watch and says ..... "Probably at work."

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

It said, "Insert disk #3," but only two will fit!

h***@sbcglobal.net

2007-02-12 05:54:41 UTC

yep, we give humans way too much in the way of exclusive ability to think
and reason. & dont forget, some of these other critters have had eons of
evolutionary expertise in dealing with the occasional problems of human
interference! and they win too! we seem to be ruthless killers for no
reasons at all!

release of grey parrots from zoo in NY city awhile back, they migrated east
to connecticut, began habitating/building HUGE stick nests around (what
else) telephone poles cross arms, complete with transformers and 14 KV feed
thru lines!

30-40 birds per nest, quite a probem for power crews! of course, animal
rights folks went nuts when they had to start removing them!. u can read
articles abt in news archives. quite interesting

:-))

Post by Peter Hucker
They're cleverer than you think. One escaped, and flew from tree to tree

waiting for me to chase after him. Came back the following day by himself,
after flying for miles all over the place.

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron overheating,

or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Peter Hucker
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com

http://www.petersphotos.com

Post by Peter Hucker
A Pakistani arrives in London City all excited. He stops the first person

he meets. "Good day, Mr. British, thank you to accept me in Your nice
country", but the person interrupts and says: "I am not British, I'm
Chinese."

Post by Peter Hucker
The Pakistani continues on his way and meets another passer-by. "Thank you

Mr. British for to let my family and me stay here... " Again, he's
interrupted before finishing his sentence. "I no be British, I be Turk!"

Post by Peter Hucker
He goes a little farther and meets another person and greets him "thank

you for letting me come to your beautiful country." ... "I'm not British,
I'm Kosavon."

Post by Peter Hucker
"But," answers the Pakistani distressed, "where are the British??"
The Kosavon looks at his watch and says ..... "Probably at work."

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com

http://www.petersphotos.com

Post by Peter Hucker
It said, "Insert disk #3," but only two will fit!

Peter Hucker

2007-02-12 13:42:55 UTC

That sounds familiar. My greys love power cords!

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
yep, we give humans way too much in the way of exclusive ability to think
and reason. & dont forget, some of these other critters have had eons of
evolutionary expertise in dealing with the occasional problems of human
interference! and they win too! we seem to be ruthless killers for no
reasons at all!
release of grey parrots from zoo in NY city awhile back, they migrated east
to connecticut, began habitating/building HUGE stick nests around (what
else) telephone poles cross arms, complete with transformers and 14 KV feed
thru lines!
30-40 birds per nest, quite a probem for power crews! of course, animal
rights folks went nuts when they had to start removing them!. u can read
articles abt in news archives. quite interesting
:-))

Post by Peter Hucker
They're cleverer than you think. One escaped, and flew from tree to tree

waiting for me to chase after him. Came back the following day by himself,
after flying for miles all over the place.

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
most with glass rotating trays will run, the glass absorbs enough rays

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
heat up slightly but wont smoke anything.
might ruin your electric bill budget though. ;-))
shakle the damm bird to the cage/perch
or teach the bird to climb inside to warm itself up. ;-P

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will

break it?

Post by Peter Hucker
Even more worrying - will it catch fire or explode?
Don't they have a safety cutout? Can't it sense the Klystron

overheating,

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
or a build up of microwaves over a certain level?

Post by Peter Hucker
I have purchased a new microwave which has an easier to grab control.

I'm

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
concerned one of my pet parrots will switch it on! (Seriously, they do
stuff like that)

Post by Peter Hucker
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com

http://www.petersphotos.com

Post by Peter Hucker
A Pakistani arrives in London City all excited. He stops the first

person

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
he meets. "Good day, Mr. British, thank you to accept me in Your nice
country", but the person interrupts and says: "I am not British, I'm
Chinese."

Post by Peter Hucker
The Pakistani continues on his way and meets another passer-by. "Thank

you

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
Mr. British for to let my family and me stay here... " Again, he's
interrupted before finishing his sentence. "I no be British, I be Turk!"

Post by Peter Hucker
He goes a little farther and meets another person and greets him "thank

you for letting me come to your beautiful country." ... "I'm not

British,

Post by h***@sbcglobal.net
I'm Kosavon."

Post by Peter Hucker
"But," answers the Pakistani distressed, "where are the British??"
The Kosavon looks at his watch and says ..... "Probably at work."

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com

http://www.petersphotos.com

Post by Peter Hucker
It said, "Insert disk #3," but only two will fit!

--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

The ant can lift 50 times its own weight, can pull 30 times its own weight, and always falls over on its right side when intoxicated.

Mary-Jane Rottencrotch

2017-12-11 04:07:43 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?

Derp.

James Wilkinson Sword

2017-12-11 16:50:48 UTC

Post by Peter Hucker
Is it really true that turning on a microwave with nothing in it will break it?

Derp.

It was a sensible question. This could be done by accident.

--
If you had to identify, in one word, the reason why the human race has not achieved, and never will achieve, its full potential, that word would be "meetings."

rickman

2017-12-12 03:49:55 UTC